A talk with Georg Laue

?: Mr Laue, in December 1997 you opened the Kunstkammer Georg Laue here in Munich near the Old and New Pinakothek. What made you choose Munich for your antiques business and what distinguishes the Kunstkammer Georg Laue from the many other antique businesses in this city?

Georg Laue: Yes, you have touched on a rather surprising point straight off. Why would anyone start an antique business today? Why would one open it in a smallish city like Munich?
Well, to do so one needs a healthy portion of idealism and self-confidence as well as a personal philosophy. I had wanted to have my own business with the main focus on Kunstkammer objects for many years. While I was working in my father’s antiques business I was intensely preoccupied with Renaissance Kunstkammer and Wunderkammer. At university, I studied the subject in a more scholarly and systematic manner so that I feel I have acquired a good knowledge of the field.
Munich became the place for the Kunstkammer Georg Laue more or less by chance because I had actually intended to settle in London, Paris or Berlin. Nat least because these cities are the major centres of the art and antiques business an, in the case of Berlin, building up something from the beginning in the capital would have been particularly challenging. However, I grew up in Munich and for that reason alone I’m especially close to this city even though I’m anything but parochial. Perhaps what I’m trying to do is to link up in some way with Munich tradition. Don’t forget that, until the outbreak of the Second World War, Munich led the field with Berlin in Germany in art and antiques. I’m thinking of names like Bernheimer or Drey.
Two years ago I came across these lovely rooms here in Schelling Strasse. In 1873, Blersch, the Royal Bavarian Court Stucco Master, designed this matchless interior with its columns and grand stucco ceiling decorated with frescoes. We were given carte blanche to restore the entire gallery to its original state and so we have a setting, which is ideally suited to realizing the idea of a Kunstkammer, my ‘Theatrum Mundi’.
This idea and the way I have carried it out are what distinguish the Kunstkammer from other antique businesses.

?: What does your ‘Theatrum Mundi’ look like, Mr Laue?

Georg Laue: As the term implies, I’m trying to create a ‘microcosm’ in which natural objects and art objects can co-exist on an equal footing. The idea behind all this is the concept of the Gesamtkunstwerk, a total work of art, which, however, is always in a state of flux. The objects come and go. This keeps the ‘Theatrum Mundi’ in perpetual motion like a theatre with guest repertory companies. Moreover, every visitor, depending on his or her interests or way of seeing things, changes the momentary atmosphere of my Kunstkammer.

?: That sounds very poetic. Could you explain how you have translated your conception into concrete form?

Georg Laue: The Kunstkammer is intentionally laid out as an open sales gallery and not as a faceless antiques business off a stair landing. I would like to give everyone the opportunity of simply walking into the world of Kunstkammer and Wunderkammer. Of course ‘browsers’ are not all that likely to purchase one of these very valuable objects, many of which are museum pieces, on the spur of the moment but I can give them the possibility of studying and thinking about them. What I’d really like to do is make a new generation of young collectors enthusiastic about Kunstkammer and Wunderkammer as such. Perhaps my generation is also gradually beginning to realize that one can collect wonders. Naturally, becoming a collector in this field is an expensive undertaking. However, wonders are priceless. Or can you tell me what a wonder costs?

?: Could your Kunstkammer be thought of as a sort of ‘mission station’?

Georg Laue: Well, um, I’m not a missionary but I am concerned with the didactic aspect, which, in other words, form an integral part of the original Kunstkammer idea. Granted, the Kunstkammer Georg Laue is not a branch of the Adult Education Centre but, in addition to buying and selling works of art, I would like to offer my assistance to others in building up collections, by helping to design exhibitions and by answering questions on specialist publications. I believe that it is especially important for the new generation of young collectors not only to lose their inhibitions but also to bridge the historical distance to the objects. Consequently, in my Kunstkammer I try o show the context in which these objects originated. In order to do this and in addition to giving lectures on the art historical and technical aspects, I’d like to encourage people to learn about Renaissance literature, philosophy and music.

?: What, in your view, justifies the existence of a Kunstkammer in the Renaissance sense of the word in the modern world?

Georg Laue: We’re living in a time that is notable for the fleeting glance, everything is fast-paced and life is hectic.
Nowadays there would scarcely seem to be world enough and time for collectors and connoisseurs to study and live with extraordinary, unique natural objects and art objects, especially since this takes up so much time. To me, this means the quality of life is depreciating. I hope to counteract the current trend here somewhat with my conception of a Kunstkammer. Part of learning about the realm of Kunstkammer and Wunderkammer is learning to see, getting involved with the objects and the world-view of a vanished era. I think the ability to empathize with other situations and eras, to view things from a different perspective in order to develop a certain aesthetic sensitivity, is an important human quality. Dealing with what is unique, with individual works of art, is more than ever, as I see it, a source of strength and inner resources.
The central idea underlying all Kunstkammer collections is comprehending the interplay of art and nature. That this interaction was very highly regarded in the Renaissance is reflected in the status artists enjoyed then. The education of princes even included learning a craft and there are quite a few objects turned at the lathe by royal hands. Collectors, both royalty and commoners, literally tried to grasp the world and to recreate it in designing their Kunstkammer.
Objects were made for these Kunstkammer by Europe’s leading artists and curiosities were imported, often by art agents, from faraway lands. At the same time, attempts were made at designing systems for ordering collections and amassing knowledge for understanding the world. The curiosity this approach entailed, the way the world was constituted then and the awe felt for it seem to have been lost somewhere along the way.
Nowadays here is such an information overload and a superficial idea of something is gleaned from secondary sources, which are quickly accessible so that hardly anyone takes the time now to internalise what is really there and has been handed down to us in the way of knowledge and skills. We often seem to be so absolutely sure, especially nowadays, that we understand all phenomena with the knowledge we have and could, therefore, solve all problems as quickly as possible. I think that is all fallacy. Even now many natural phenomena are unexplained, let alone the ability to reproduce the skilled craftsmanship that can be seen in the objects here. In this respect they are simply miraculous, mirabilia, which, as we have said, can be collected. Apart from the investment represented by the purchase of these objects, one can, therefore, acquire a certain quality of life in my Kunstkammer by gaining the possibility of creating a special, a unique ambience for oneself.
That is part of what justifies the existence of my Kunstkammer. On the other hand, I view the Kunstkammer, as I’ve already said, as a venue, a sort of discussion forum or ‘reloading point’ for knowledge.

?: In the media age we live in today there are certainly much more accessible forums for discussion or ‘reloading points’. What I’m thinking of are the possibilities offered by the Internet. What do you feel about this development, are you against it?

Georg Laue: No, on the contrary. We have installed a homepage and are enthusiastic about the possibilities e-mail communication offers for exchanging information even though I still have a weakness for the scratch of a pen on all sorts of creasable papers.
What the Internet can’t offer, however, is direct interaction between people and the tactile approach to the works of art. The feeling of holding one of these precious marvels in one’s hand, an object that perhaps Rudolf II also held in his hands to admire, can only be grasped through direct contact with the object itself. You’ll never get a feel for the lightness of an early Venetian glass, the massiveness of an elephant skull or the twists and turnings of narwhal horn via a cyber glove. You’ll have to come here for that. That makes for reassurance about the future and perhaps additional justification for my Kunstkammer.

?: How much interest does the public show in Renaissance art and curiosities?

Georg Laue: In recent years museums especially have become extremely active in staging exhibitions and we have been able to help out by loaning objects. Offhand, exhibitions in the Museum Reich der Kristalle here in Munich, in the Deutsches Medizinhistorisches Museum in Ingolstadt, the Grassi Museum in Leipzig or the amber exhibitions in Lüneburg and Bochum com to mind. Just the number of recent exhibition catalogues piling up on my shelves shows how interested museums are in the subject of ‘Kunstkammer’. Think of the ‘Moritz der Gelehrte’ exhibition in Kassel, the ‘Wunderkammer des Abendlandes’ exhibition in Bonn, the inventory catalogues of Gottdorf Castle in Schleswig or the current exhibition in Museum Ambras Castle, just to name a few examples. Museums are certainly interested. What is still missing is more active commitment to this field on the part of the younger generation of private collectors. One shouldn’t just rely on museum activities to encourage it. The positive response of so many young visitors to the Kunstkammer Georg Laue clearly shows, I think, that, apart from museums, art dealers must rise to the challenge of contributing to building up a new generation of collectors.

?: What do your upcoming projects look like, what are your plans?

Georg Laue: We’ve got a lot in the pipeline. First, small, thematic exhibitions are planned, portraying individual workshops and artists as well as exhibitions surveying particular groups of materials. We have already taken up the system of ordering objects by materials in the way we have designed our catalogue. This was the standard principle according to which Renaissance Kunstkammer were arranged and it was carried out very consistently in Ambras Castle, for instance. All this is just by the way. On the other hand, plans already exist for exhibitions in conjunction with contemporary art. I’m not thinking so much of established artists here although there, too, some links should be clarified. But the best thing to do is just wait and see.
Besides, as I’ve already said, I plan to place even more emphasis on conveying the original context in which the objects were made and at irregular intervals will stage events of this nature in the Kunstkammer. In order to understand art, one should not fail to take a look at the history of ideas surrounding it even though the objects can speak for themselves. But you do have to be able to understand what they are saying, you have to listen to them and take the time to get involved with them with all five senses.

Munich, August 1999
I am indebted to Julia Lachenmann
for suggesting this discussion.

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